A newbie guide on kX's (DSP) concept or "How to setup your DSP".

Discussion in 'Effects and the DSP' started by Lex Nahumury, Sep 11, 2004.

  1. Maddogg6

    Maddogg6 Tail Razer

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    sorry to resurrect this post in between a conversation...

    But since this was originally posted - I have found some DSP plugins that maybe adding additional latency within the kX DSP - For instance The Dynamics Processor has a 'look ahead' (L. Ahead) feature, that certainly looks to me like it adds more latency (up to 4ms in addition to kX ASIO latency settings) , that would not be otherwise obvious - and could account for the OP's 'timing' problem or 'bad feel of rhythm' as he put it.

    edit: Add that to the probably MIDI device your 'tapping on' built in 'latency' - and it can all add up to the appearance of 'bad timing'. /edit.

    Maybe others will benefit from this post later, if the OP hasnt yet already figured this out.

    Back to you Russ :D (again, sorry for the interuption)
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2008
  2. Russ

    Russ Well-Known Member

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    lol, I am not sure that I was in the middle of a conversation (I think I answered the question, no?) :D

    BTW: Do not forget that the distance that your speakers are away from you also makes a difference.

    i.e.
    10 feet would give something like 9 ms additional latency.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2008
  3. Maddogg6

    Maddogg6 Tail Razer

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    I wasn't sure either (if the OP would return with more questions) so I went the safe rout and made it clear my post was not related to what was most recently asked (this has caused me to have to re-read things from similar situations, out of initial confusion 'whats that quote got to do with anything...??' ), thus my clear explanation, bla bla bla.... :D
     
  4. siebenhirter

    siebenhirter New Member

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    Your guide successful makes kX's concept more understandable for new users.
    Especially amateur-Musicians like me - thank you very much!
    a tiny riddle is following errormessage after translating ProFX-Plugin "SRC":
    - (12): error S100: unknown character '('
    Content of line 12 in microcode of SRC is: macs Left, 0x0, KX_FX(0x0), 0x7fffffff;
    maybe definition of the name KX_FX is not correct?
    in my c:/programme/kxProject/sdk3537/h/interface/efxnames.h i found:

    Line 55: const char *operand_names_k1[0x5e]=
    Line 56: {
    Line 57: "KX_FX(0x0)"
    ,"KX_FX(0x1)"
    ,"KX_FX(0x2)"
    ,"KX_FX(0x3)"
    .
    .
    Line 173: const char *operand_names_k2[0xee]=
    Line 174: {
    Line 175: "KX_FX(0x0)"
    ,"KX_FX(0x1)"
    ,"KX_FX(0x2)"
    ,"KX_FX(0x3)"
    .
    maybe spaces instead ',' in lines 57 und 175 are the reason of that errormessage?
    but when i insert commas in lines 57 and 175 what is to do with efxnames.h and how
    (save, compile, link or what else) ? i am not a programmer - but how can i get out of that message
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Win XP, Sp2 / kX 5.10.00.3537 / Audigy SB0090 [c400] / ProFx v 3.08 5.10.00.3534
     
  5. siebenhirter

    siebenhirter New Member

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    thank you for your answer about plugin SRC
    the renaming did not cause the errormessage - that message also occurs without modification
    of the microcode by actualizing it - i think something is not true with the strings KX_FX
    in line 12 and 13 of microcode - maybe that is the reason for impossibility to change microcode
    without errormessage. i am not a programmer - for me it seems definitions are locatet in
    efxnames.h - without knowledges of handling (how to compile or link?) such a file i cant do
    anything (sorry - also no renaming of SRC for my neccesary seems possible)
     
  6. Maddogg6

    Maddogg6 Tail Razer

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    Yes, I am pretty sure that is correct, to use those 'registers' you need to compile the plugin with Microsoft Visual C++ to use kX_FX(0x0)... which the source code is found in kX API folder where you installed kX.

    Many plugins requires compile with MSVC++ - but *some* things can be done with out MSVC++

    (edited)
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2008
  7. Russ

    Russ Well-Known Member

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    As Maddogg6 indicated, it is not an error with the plugin, the error is because physical inputs/outputs can only be used in .DLL based plugins (ProFx:SRC is a .DLL). The code for such plugins cannot be successfully edited using kX Editor. Even though you did not actually edit the code, by clicking the Update DSP Microcode button, you are asking kX Editor to parse the code as if it were not a .DLL (and update the run-time code if no errors are found), and it gives an error because the code contains physical inputs (or outputs), which again are only allowed in .DLL based plugins.

    What is it that you are trying to do?
     
  8. Lex Nahumury

    Lex Nahumury DH Senior Member

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    Thanks, I'm glad my guide helped you somehow.
    However guys... maddog, russ too;
    Please keep this particulair thread free from Dane microcode/C++ 'Voodoo' talk.
    This guide and it's thread is an effort to make kX simple to new users,
    not to scare them away!:eek:

    There's plenty of room for discussing kX programming details elsewere here
    on our forum. Just start a new thread and we are happy to assist if needed.

    Cheers,

    /Lex.
     
  9. Russ

    Russ Well-Known Member

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    I understand, but the question was asked here....
     
  10. siebenhirter

    siebenhirter New Member

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    Thank you Maddogg6, Russ and Lex Nahumury for your expansive activity for my tiny-tiniest problem. I think my english is as bad as not be understoodable in that case - in future may i post in german? But once again i try to stay in english:

    I found the tutorial "A newbie guide on kX's concept or "How to setup your own DSP" - for musicians (by Lex Nahumury)" - its very fine for me, easy and goot to work - also for some friends of mine - hobbiests in music with keyboards, hammond-organs, e-piano, synthesizers and MIDI-players!

    In that tutorial there is an simple example with ProFX Plugins - for playback is used plugin "SRC" renamed to "Src FXBus 0/1" an for external analog input is used an "SRC" renamed to "Src Line-In" (ds_profx_1.jpg).

    Same i want to do, but it is not possible to rename my playback to "Src FXBus 0/1" or any other name, because following error occurs " - (12): error S100: unknown character '(' ".

    This errormessage is the problem - but not dramtical, because function of used "SRC" is ok. But using some more necessary SRCs it looks terrible all named "SRC". I want rename it to "Keybord PSR8000", the next to "MasterKeyboard", the third to "Yamaha HS6", the next to "Cakewalk Midi Player" etc. A setup with different names of different connected sources is easier to handle as a setup, where each source has the same name - in that case i could use the ungovernably standard FX-Bus without visible name of used sources.

    But that ist exactly the reason, why musicians would not use FX-Bus - we want to build our own simple DSP setup with descriptive names of our hardware (instruments, players) we use connected with kXProject. We want to use our descriptions also understandable for all of us ant other hobby-musicians.

    As i mentioned yesterday, on my opinion its only required, the administrator (creator) of EFXNAMES.H should set the absent "," on first position of lines 57 and 175 and make it disposial for download after compiling. I do not touch libraries of creators - not even because i have no knowledges how to create sourcecode for applications. After correct definition of the Array KX_FX, which is used in Microcode "SRC" no error should occur, as definition KX(nn) than is known as usable constant in an activateable microcode.
     
  11. Russ

    Russ Well-Known Member

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    Again, it seems that you are not using the correct method to rename the plugin instance, as none of the above applies to renaming the plugin instance (as in the example). To rename the plugin instance, choose 'Rename' from the menu instead of 'Edit' (I only assume that you are choosing 'Edit', because that is the only way you would be seeing the microcode and getting the error (and the error is intentional)).

    i.e.
    Load ProFX:SRC
    Right-click on the plugin's representation in the DSP and choose "Rename" from the menu.
    Type in the new name/alias and click the OK button (check mark).

    i.e.
    See this picture.

    Note that this does not affect the name used in the plugin's tweak window.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2008
  12. Lex Nahumury

    Lex Nahumury DH Senior Member

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    @siebenhirter;
    Just follow Russ's instructions;
    choose 'Rename', NOT 'Edit' from the menu
    if you want to change any plugins name.

    German;
    Du sollst den richtigen option aus das menu walen wenn du
    den namen einer plugin andern wilst.
    Wale 'Rename', nicht 'Edit'.
    Durch uberzetsung nach deutsch heisen die beiden optionen vieleicht anders
    als 'edit' und 'rename' aber wenn du Russ's fotos anschaust sollte es deutlich sein.

    Gruss, /Lex
     
  13. siebenhirter

    siebenhirter New Member

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    @nahumry and russ
    sorry - i apologize for my clumsy procedure to try renaming in microcode instead of menue.
    the irretant word "error" by my first entry using kxProject made me blind to follow your
    conclusive instructions as i thougt any change - also the name - of plugins requires to actualize
    microcode in any case.
    staying on surface of kxProject (menuehandled) its now very easy to realize first steps to build
    a satisfying configuration using audigy/live-cards with kxProjects software.

    setups of hardware and software i often see from hobby-musicians is too expansive and usually poor in
    quality, flexibility in handling, enlargement and adaption - compared what is possible with EMU-Chip
    acting with kXProjects software. And especially ProFx-plugins are easy in handling -
    so you did it not as complicated as i did first time!

    now my critical friends have problems to prove her statements, that good music is only possible with mega-equipment
    and hardware - i have no problems to make competition with my small equipment and tenth of costs, assuming we use same
    high-end-equipment of amplifiers and speakers.

    Audigy/Live-card with EMU-Chip + kxProject driver + comfortable ProFx-plugins = best components for me and maybe also for 90% of musicians,
    beeing privates, hobbyists or semiprofessionals.

    PS: i am delighted that there was no difference causing by deficiency in language. No translation necesseary in the future - it was me caused the miss - sorry once again!
     

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