American Thinks.....

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Forum' started by Shwompy, Jan 3, 2005.

  1. Pompey

    Pompey New Member

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    He does have a point. The way he types is just annoying.
    I know I said I wouldn’t rant on about Vietnam but I feel justice has not been done for the Vietnamese people by Violat's post. The estimated number of Vietnamese currently suffering disabilities is around 1 million. 500,000 have died since and during the war from America’s use of chemical weapons. A further 1million died during the war of "conventual" bombing.
    At least 72 million litres of defoliants (like Agent Orange) was dropped on Vietnam. I thought I'd share a picture of a baby affected from Agent Orange released on the country 30 years ago.


    [​IMG]


    Communist North Vietnam was an American invention. "Vietnam was a lie. From the beginning, throughout the war, and even today as they are trying to write it into the history books."
    They didn’t try and gain support from Russia of China they were even pro American. They only accepted aid from the soviets and Chinese after America sided with the South Vietnamese "democratic" government and attacked North Vietnam. Another shining example of Americas righteousness.
     
  2. OldBuzzard

    OldBuzzard DH's oldest Geek

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    Pompey, that is a load of revisionist history drivel. Of course, since you were orn 10 years after the US left Vietnam, I guess you might have something of an excuse for believing such balderdash.

    The French will be quite disappointed to find that it was an 'American Invention', since one of their 'celebrated battles' was at Din Bien Piu. Of course, like most of France's 'celebrated battles', they got a butt whippin, and that is why they left Vietnam in 1954 or 1955.

    As for Agent Orange, it was not used as a WMD, and in fact it was dropped in areas where US troops were also. Unfortunately, we weren't aware of it's long term effects, but of course you won'r believe that either because you were brainwashed while in school.

    I guess you also think that the Tet Offensive was a North Viet victory too, since that was the way the Liberal Media reoprted it. In truth it was a crushing defeat for the North, and if the polititions wouldn't have been such candy asses, and allowed the military to have done their jobs the way they wanted to, we would have won that war, and wouldn't have left with a whimper like the liberals wanted us to.

    You need to talk to the people that were really there, and get the truth. Quit believing what the draft dodging peacenicks taught you.
     
  3. kp59583

    kp59583 New Member

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    Communist North Vietnam was an American invention. "Vietnam was a lie. From the beginning, throughout the war, and even today as they are trying to write it into the history books."
    They didn’t try and gain support from Russia of China they were even pro American. They only accepted aid from the soviets and Chinese after America sided with the South Vietnamese "democratic" government and attacked North Vietnam. Another shining example of Americas righteousness.
    [/QUOTe



    Ho Chi Min, In 1919 he petitioned the great powers at the Versailles peace talks for equal rights in Indochina but was ignored. He soon helped form the French Communist Party and spent much time in Moscow. He later moved to Hong Kong, where he founded the Vietnamese Communist Party.
     
  4. [)arkNova

    [)arkNova New Member

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    I can't believe what I'm reading. There are a lot of "blame America first people" on this forum. If you think America is that bad, go to France or Germany. They will love you for your dump on America attitude. We do more for this Earth than anyone. We give more relief,free more countries from punk killers like Sadam.Stop talking from your democrat play book and say something great about our country. For God's sake,alot of people died for you to be able to say such things.:annoyed:
     
  5. Driver 7

    Driver 7 Discombobulated NVidiot

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    Man these topic's bring out so many emotions it's kinda frightening.

    I have 2 cents. Probably the 2 that might be expected from a canuck. Forget for 1 minute what country your from. We are all from earth. We are all humans. All completely equal. no one any better than any other. Can you really hate someone else because of what someone else's government does. Live for yourself.

    As for bush. He is a hero. Even if he did go to Iraq for nothing but getting his hands on the oil. His greed took the evil that existed for entirely to long and removed it. I say shame on the rest of the guys in the world who had the power to put an end to it a long time ago and instead sat by and let it happen.

    It sucks that anyone has to live a rough life. Wish I could make the world all good.
     
  6. kp59583

    kp59583 New Member

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    Bush didn't go invade Iraq for the Oil. If 9/11 hadn't happened we would have never went into Iraq. It's the same princible of WW2. Someone attacks us and we immediatly start headhunting. During WW2 Japan attacked us and then we declare war on Germany and Italy which didn't. The fact of the matter is if Someone attacks the US, then who ever does it and there associates better watch out cause the hammer will fall on the ones we feel are a threat.
     
  7. Falstaff

    Falstaff Old Codger

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    Iraq was invaded because Hussien didnt comply with the UN, Afghanistan was the staging ground for terriorists. We havent recieved any renumeration from oil or anything else in Iraq.
     
  8. BWX

    BWX get out and ride

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    Yes, if we attacked Iraq for the oil... where is all the oil, and why have our gas prices gone up? It seems if we attacked for the oil, we would have it by now correct? We probably won't even get paid back for the BILLIONS of dollars it took to oust Saddam. Some countries want the innocent Iraqi people to pay Saddam's old debts off.. you guys should be complaining about that.
     
  9. OldBuzzard

    OldBuzzard DH's oldest Geek

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    kp59583, you need to check out your US History a little better.

    We declared war on Japan on 8 December in response to their attack on Pearl Harbor and the Philippines.

    On 11 December we declared war on Germany and Italy in response to THEIR declaring way on us.

    On 12 December after receiving declarations or war from Hungary, Romania, and Bulgaria, we also declared war on them.
     
  10. Senor_Mota

    Senor_Mota 悪魔の方法

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    Well, our country wants us(the innocent people that we are :p) to pay some extremely old debts off...and we keep paying and paying and paying and it just keeps getting bigger and bigger. And why complain about another country's affairs? Maybe that's why we have so many goddamn problems - we just can't mind our own f*cking business. We would rather feed a bunch of starving Bosnians han the homeless people here. We would rather get involved in foreign affairs with countries that hate us than form some new trade embargoe with a newfound ally. MAYBE WE SHOULD JUST KEEP OUR HEADS BELOW THE FENCE FOR AWHILE...BECAUSE YOU CAN'T SHOOT WHAT YOU CAN'T SEE.
     
  11. BWX

    BWX get out and ride

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    First of all, who is "us"? Second of all, what in bloody hell does that have to do with the topic?
     
  12. kp59583

    kp59583 New Member

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    We used to but After WWII that changed and the only reason it changed was the attack by Japan. At the time there where a lot of people in this country that thought that it was Europes war and didn't want to get involved. Japan gave Roosevelt the excuse he needed.

    OldBuzzard your right but we would have attacked Germany and Italy weither they declared war on us or not.
     
  13. OldBuzzard

    OldBuzzard DH's oldest Geek

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    ROFL...

    Read your OWN post again. The odds are, given the fact that there was an 'isolationist' feeling in the states, which YOU just posted about, would have kept us out of Europe, and we would have concentrated on Japan only.

    There were way too many people in the States that where actually sympathetic to Germany at that time, and if Hitler would have left well enough alone, we would have stayed out of Europe, and the world today would be a whole lot different than it is now.
     
  14. Pompey

    Pompey New Member

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    America gives more relief simply because of its size and wealth. We are a far smaller nation and are on of the poorest of the western counties and per head of population we donate far more than America, From memory far more than any other nation. I’m still trying to find the exact numbers (no charts ive found so far have NZ on them but America is always near the bottom or dead last)So if you have any UN figures (or other sorces with both NZ and America on it) please post them.

    I don’t own Any democratic hand book had have never been to Democratic (the party) sites. Maybe you should stop reading from your republican Bible. Its the American government I hate, I have no problem with the people as a whole. America has done some good in the world, without America I doubt we would be as technologically advance as we are today. Without America we would still have rigid 19th century European customs and culture.

    What was the whole "a lot of people died to say such things" comment about?

    As ive already said, America supported saddam and had it not been for American anti-communist pro fascist policy He wouldn’t have had a free reign for all those years. The Iraqi debate is simply does the ends justify the means. Unlike alot of people I dont think America went in their for oil, or atleast not entirely.

    Your kidding. So for Israel, one of Americas other allies, or America herself its ok to not comply with the UN. But if its Saddam its not ok? The contracts have almost all exclusively been awarded to American companies. Like I siad above, In Iraqs case, does the ends justify the means. Americas position has been Yes. Murder and torture are justified when deposing a tyrant who...... murders and tortures people.
    Of course, it wasn’t Americas policy to torture people, The president just has a right to ok it. right?

    On the Issue of America in WWII...
    Europe: America’s entry into the War only speeds up Germany’s defeat. Britain and her allies were going to win eitherway. The war would have dragged on for another few years.
    Pacific: Hard to say, Britain and France may have gone in after Hitters defeat to save their empires, but difficult to tell. NZ and Australia would have been invaded and who knows, we could have ended up part of Imperial Japan.
     
  15. kp59583

    kp59583 New Member

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    You might want to read some history on Roosevelt. All he wanted was an excuse to enter the war against Germany. The people would have follow him into any war after Japan attacked Pearl Harbor.
    President Roosevelt's Message To Congress on the Atlantic Charter



    August 21, 1941
    [White House news release.]


    TO THE CONGRESS OF THE UNITED STATES:

    Over a week ago I held several important conferences at sea with the British Prime Minister. Because of the factor of safety to British, Canadian and American ships and their personnel no prior announcement of these meetings could properly be made.

    At the close, a public statement by the Prime Minister and the President was made. I quote it for the information of the Congress and for the record:

    [Text of August 14th announcement here.]

    The Congress and the President having heretofore determined through the Lend Lease Act on the national policy of American aid to the democracies which East and West are waging war against dictatorships, the military and naval conversations at these meetings made clear gains in furthering the effectiveness of this aid.

    Furthermore, the Prime Minister and I are arranging for conferences with the Soviet Union to aid it in its defense against the attack made by the principal aggressor of the modern world-- Germany.

    Finally, the declaration of principles at this time presents a goal which is worth while for our type of civilization to seek. It is so clear cut that it is difficult to oppose in any major particular without automatically admitting a willingness to accept compromise with Nazism; or to agree to a world peace which would give to Nazism domination over large numbers of conquered nations. Inevitably such a peace would be a gift to Nazism to take breath--armed breath--for a second war to extend the control over Europe and Asia to the American Hemisphere itself.

    It is perhaps unnecessary for me to call attention once more to the utter lack of validity of the spoken or written word of the Nazi government.

    It is also unnecessary for me to point out that the declaration of principles includes of necessity the world need for freedom of religion and freedom of information. No society of the world organized under the announced principles could survive without these freedoms which are a part of the whole freedom for which we strive.
     
  16. [)arkNova

    [)arkNova New Member

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    Fine hate American government,I'm not going to try to change you. But that says a lot. Meaning you hate freedom,capitalism,standing up against tyrants. America is a representive government,we the people elected those people in our government.Hate the government then you hate the people. But without America,France would be speaking german right now with Nazi rule,the UN would not be in existance,WWII would have been a lot more bloody,communist would be in your back yard,terrorism would be the norm for your country,bin laden would be running for office some where,Stalin's relatives still would be killing the people you would call your friends.

    As for republican bible,cute comment. I guess.

    A lot of people died for our freedom,American blood.("a lot of people died to say such things") American blood spilt in Iraq for freedom,in France for freedom,and many other occurances for freedom.




     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2005
  17. FPSMaxxFoe

    FPSMaxxFoe New Member

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    You had me till you said the thing about the oil. I am so sick of hearing this tripe from people.

    If America had gone for the oil, we could take it from Kuwait! All we want, and hey guess what? They have no military or evil dictator we would have to get rid of to get the oil.

    That is exactly right. The US and most of the world was completely content to leave Germany alome. That is till they had to get involved.

    The world knew what was happening in Germany, and did not do jack till it was too late for millions.

    Thankfully though this time with Iraq the US stepped in, to help the people pf Iraq. Should we have waited now like we did in the case of Germany? I say no!

    People are quick to judge th US and our convictions. It is not always easy or popular to take the high road, but necessary.

    My son and nephew are in Iraq fighting for our Country, and the people of Iraq. I am not only proud of them, and the rest of our Military, but of my President for doing what is right.

    Clearly the majority of the military agree, since they voted for him, as did the majority of the voters.
     
  18. GOG

    GOG Please answer the voices in my head

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    They did?
     
  19. BWX

    BWX get out and ride

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    I agree.

    Two of my 1st cousins and one of my 2nd cousins are/were over there too. (they are younger than me, but all grew up within a mile from where I grew up)
    Some people will never understand and it is pointless to try to sway their opinions,at least in this forum. It seems some parts of the world are so thoroughly and completely brainwashed to hate the US and all it stands for, it is futile to even try to explain it to some people.
     
  20. CaptinSxb

    CaptinSxb New Member

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    We did pay for the majority of the war did we not?
     

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