Intel i9-12900K, MSI MEG Z690 UNIFY LGA 1700 Build. Advice Please.

Discussion in 'Hardware Discussion & Support' started by arb65912, Dec 23, 2021.

  1. arb65912

    arb65912 Well-Known Member

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    Wow, wow, wow..... I would never think of it that way.
    Thank you for sharing the info which I guess for computer gurus is quite known but for dummies like me it is just one white map area. ;-)

    Yes, please link some easier reads so I I am able to understand. Thank you!
     
  2. arb65912

    arb65912 Well-Known Member

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    Hmmm, I do not want to sell it as what would I do with that Z690 motherboard?
    As a possibility in the future I could replace processor when/if they become better in temperatures department.

    My RTX 3080 Ti arrived today and it seems that it will do the trick.
    I am running BOTH flight simulators (both GPU power hungry) and the GPU temperatures are in 70s C which I guess is pretty cool (in both meaning ;-) )

    Now as far my 12900K, I see the red numbers as max ones but average numbers seems to be "acceptable" , are they?
    What that means is that getting better cooler will not help the temperature spikes as they are random so I guess there is no reason to try to get one, correct?
    What I have now is this.
    Noctua NH-D15S chromax.black, Premium Dual-Tower CPU Cooler with NF-A15 PWM 140mm Fan (Black)

    https://www.newegg.com/noctua-nh-d15s-chromax-black/p/13C-0005-001M2?Item=9SIAADYCB28573

    Since I am not overclocking, maybe that processor will last for a while??? Or not?
     
  3. arb65912

    arb65912 Well-Known Member

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    These two SSs are with both simulators running at full screen 4k (one screen but two simulators at once)

    01.png 02.png
     
  4. Judas

    Judas Obvious Closet Brony Pony

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    this might be the easiest place to start as he sources every article and provides links





    regarding your other question.. the "current" values are obviously current, i don't put much stock in averages because this includes full idle and depending on length of time, will never show maximum, thus maximum will tell you if the cpu had hit thermal limits even briefly, though it would be nice if the monitoring program could provide duration maximums instead of peak maximum even if it was for a second.

    Everything looks well within safe measures.
     
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  5. arb65912

    arb65912 Well-Known Member

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    OK, I watched half of the video and I see that Intel is shown as a very bad boy which I am not arguing about.
    I had no idea about all these trusts, court cases and all things behind these two competitors.

    Question 1: assuming that Intel is a bad boy on the block, why does it have such a big sales? because they lie to people?
    I am not interested in politics too much but it was really interesting to know all these things kind of behind the scenes that were and are going on.

    I think I understood about maximum temperature telling only the maximum value but not the durations of it.
    But should not these durations be momentary assuming that after reaching maximum temperature processor would throttle down to avoid thermal damage?
    It is hard to answer my questions in layman's terms as I am not familiar with computer technology and terminology, just talking from very average user with only very basic computer/electronics knowledge.

    Question 2: "Everything looks well within safe measures" means that the CPU temperatures in general are "normal" in running two simulators at once.
    Normal, meaning, it should not damage the CPU?

    Thank you for being so patient with me and answering all my questions.
    It is just so much easier and faster to ask than trying to find out personally and in many case s like the Intel story I would not be even able to know no matter what I would read.
     
  6. Judas

    Judas Obvious Closet Brony Pony

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    1:

    Damage was seriously done, amd's sales never really picked up in oem or server market sufficiently enough and intel was paying out the likes of hp and dell and so forth billions to ensure that they'd never buy anything amd anyways and if they did, it was restricted to the lowest sales volumes and lowest quality products.

    By the time intel was dragged to court, amd was already in heaps of trouble even though they had a vastly superior architecture and design, specially with x86-64 (64bit) being their baby bread and butter. Intel managed to entice software development be hindered in order to remain 32bit supported, honestly the web of nonsense that went on far extends beyond any number of videos. Intel wanted amd dead, and they were willing to pay to make it happen.

    It's much the same reason that regardless of how incredible a product ATI brought out, the masses insisted on flocking to nvidia, repeatedly, even for completely garbage products like the FX 5000 series and many of the geforce 4 along with latter 8000's and 9000 series GTX that were massively problematic, specially for the mobile sector (one reason apple dump nvidia like a hot potatoe because apple ended up eating dirt). The GTX 400/500 series were terrible but still completely outsold ati/amd products.

    When you have such massive mindshare that the competition can have a massive performance lead, power lead, temp lead, and cost effective lead, and yet people will still flock because as far as they are concerned, the competition doesn't exist.

    You have any idea how many people you mention AMD to and they don't have a clue what you're talking about? But if you say intel, yup that's what they got (even in cases when it's actually amd, but they thought it was intel because it's the best they think all the time).

    Regardless, it's a massive rabbit hole.

    2:

    Intel runs their cpus into the realms of 100C, and provided that the cpu and motherboard are doing what they should do, that's the thermal limit of the chip and it'll auto throttle which in the monitor it shows it's throttling. So it's normal, but obviously not exactly ideal, it's a common problem among many 12900k users, even with 300+mm rads, people can't keep it under control temp wise. But it's operating within their designed specification. Personally even with AMD's 5000's designed to run in the 85-95C range, i dislike it for the 5600x and 5800x at least, thus i opted for better cooling and rarely see anything above 70C on a 5600x and never above 80C on a 5800x.
     
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  7. arb65912

    arb65912 Well-Known Member

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    Thank you very much @Judas

    1. Amazing story and interesting that not that many people know it but considering Intel actions, it would be rather expected.

    2. I am glad it is at least throttling instead of failing.... in other words I believe that trying to get a better cooler would probably be much of a benefit, correct?
     
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  8. Judas

    Judas Obvious Closet Brony Pony

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    It's hard to really get any better one without getting exotic like kyro cooling/vapour chiller. I'd say you're as good as you're going to get as is without investing more than it's worth
     
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  9. arb65912

    arb65912 Well-Known Member

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    OK, let it run than and I will see how I like all components working after I use it for work and fun. Thank you!
     
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  10. arb65912

    arb65912 Well-Known Member

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    @Calliers @Judas and all who feel like chipping in. :)

    Hello friends, big news here , lol,lol,lol.

    Sooooo...... I can not use Solidworks 2020 which I use at my day job will NOT run on Windows11.
    making the story short, yes I could install Windows 10 on new machine and run it but there is so much involved in setting work remotely with other sources we use at work that I did that.

    I put my new RTX 3080 Ti and extra SSD in my Ryzen machine, see my specs (I need to change GPU in my signature) and I decided to use it for all, work and fun and sell my new machine

    I uninstalled all from new machine and install Windows 11 using portable USB DVD reader (cheap one)
    I was told by my one of my IT guys that to really safely remove ALL data I need to do it few times (erasing disc and installing Windows11)

    I was doing just that, safely erasing data from my SSD and installing Windows using DVD player.

    I had Boot priority set to DVD Hard drive and Stick USB in that order.

    Unfortunately , and 4th or 5th try, my DVD was spinning for few minutes without Windows11 install screen showing up and finally reverted to BIOS.
    I repeated that few times with the same result.

    Question, can I use my Windows11 CD somehow and transfer Windows to an USB drive and try to boot from there?

    There is no rush but I think I want Windows11 installed so it sells better.

    Waiting for your help as always :)

    Thank you
     
  11. QB71

    QB71 Well-Known Member

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    Just download the Windows Media Creation Tool and go through the steps for creating a USB install drive.

    QB
     
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  12. arb65912

    arb65912 Well-Known Member

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    Thank you! I did just that but another question. If I install from USB now and activate using the serial number from DVD package I will be OK?

    As I said this PC goes for sale so I want all clean but with my Windows11 installed (I purchased the DVD on "newegg"
     
  13. Calliers

    Calliers Administrator/Editor Staff Member

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    Yes, you should be fine. Just install from USB then use the code from the disc to license your install.
     
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  14. Judas

    Judas Obvious Closet Brony Pony

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    looks like sp1 of solidworks 2022 may have windows 11 support fully
     
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  15. arb65912

    arb65912 Well-Known Member

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    Thank you. Worked fine just like you said. I did that 3 more times to be sure and I seems to be ready. ;)
     
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  16. arb65912

    arb65912 Well-Known Member

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    Yes but we did not get it. I believe it would need to be more expensive so they gave us 2020 instead.

    Not a big deal though. I built the system, had fun, upgraded my existing one so all is good.

    Had a taste of newest technology 12900k, learned about temperatures (did not like that part at all), looked at Windows11 (not impressed, just different layout) and we had a chance to interact here.

    I think with my existing setup I will be good for few years.

    Thank you for all help I got from my friends here!!!
     
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  17. QB71

    QB71 Well-Known Member

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    Not sure why you felt the need to install Windows over and over... A simple Secure Erase of the SSD and Install Windows will give a clean and pristine system. If you are really paranoid about data remaining on an SSD, you could erase it using the write 0's method, but that will shorten the life of the drive for no reason.

    QB
     
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  18. arb65912

    arb65912 Well-Known Member

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    I was told by one of the IT guys. Maybe I did not have to but I did not mind. Windows11 have this Reset Option with deleting all files which I used .

    On new Windows11 install I used the option to install only Windows a swell.

    I am not paranoid at all about it but since I hade there my work setup and company files and settings including remote accesses, passwords to server etc., I simply wanted to do the best I could, just in case. :)

    By the way , what is write 0's method?
    It is probably to long to describe here but maybe you have a link explaining it?
     
  19. Judas

    Judas Obvious Closet Brony Pony

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    Secure erase or low level format (write 0 or zeroing out a drive).. the latter of which should not be performed on ssds technically, but are more suited for spinning disks though be prepared to wait a long time, is to basically completely clear a drive of all data as well as ensure nothing could be potentially recovered using elaborate recovery tools.

    One of the function of AsRock's many boards that many people don't even notice due to other brands no including anything of the sort, is the fact that secure erase is a feature built into the bios, makes for cleaning any SSD a simple easy fix solution without effort. AsRock also provides santizer solution which frankly i've yet to figure out what advantage or disadvantages it has over secure erase, it appears to be less of a 0 write and more of a "will just scrub the tables, leave the data there, but you can't see the data so it just gets overwritten as if it was just deleted the normal way".

    In any other case my preferred method of cleaning a drive so it responds/acts like new without doing a full low level format (0 write) is using diskpart (built into windows) and it's clean function. IT's a free, simple built in tool and where other tools have failed to do it right, diskclean is like the brute forced ultimate kick.
     
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  20. arb65912

    arb65912 Well-Known Member

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    How do I find it in Windows and run it? I mean diskpart.

    Since I have Windows on the only SSD drive in that machine for sell , how I will use the tool to clean if Windows are installed?

    Sorry for a dummy questions, I am just curious, Judas. :)
     

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