wishlist v_0.1

Discussion in 'Effects and the DSP' started by isdochegal, May 21, 2004.

  1. isdochegal

    isdochegal New Member

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    Hallo,

    nice driver. At least, if you don't have Creatives original CD.

    [API]
    I miss an non-M?C API-DLL for the driver (ever heard of people, not being interested in C++?).

    [DRIVER, Dsound]
    Than, it might be nice (but possible?) to have the DSound-Driver optionally blend 3D-buffers directly to DSP-space (maybe as 3Dvec in GPR and samples as xtram?). The actual 9-ch design only really satisfies for very unusual Speaker-config, I think.
    Forward all WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE channels to DSP. Most (maybe all?) applications won't ever attempt to use all of these channels simultaneously with using 3D-buffers.

    [DOC]
    - maybe write add some word on sense of modules to the SDK?
    - Add more descriptive description to the DSP-effects.
    - design a better (maybe huge) signal-flow-chart for what's going on around the DSP for all supported cards
    - now, how to implement DSP-lookup-tables?

    [ASM-Edit]
    - add support for assembling (not only for opposite) of absolute operands.
    - add "type/properties of control"
    - add keyword such as "controlledby test.dll"

    Grussauch

    Jan
     
  2. Lex Nahumury

    Lex Nahumury DH Senior Member

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    >>nice driver. At least, if you don't have Creatives original CD.

    If 'not having Creative's original CD' qualifice kX driver as 'nice',
    I fail to see the point of the remaining part of your post..:cool:

    /LeMury
     
  3. Tiger M

    Tiger M kX user

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    I guess there is no need to comment the far superiority of kX drivers over the Creative ones...
    There is just no point... it's so very obvious!
     
  4. isdochegal

    isdochegal New Member

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    > [DRIVER, Dsound]
    > The actual 9-ch design only really satisfies for very unusual Speaker-config, I think.

    Hmn, I just realized, that it seems to be 5-ch, at best, maybe even less.
    I want a soundcard providing positional 3D audio.


    Grussauch

    Jan
     
  5. dj_stick

    dj_stick Apple Fanboy?

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    i think kX already has positional audio
     
  6. Rogacz

    Rogacz Porcupine Floyd

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    I`d like to see 6.1 support.
     
  7. Eminos

    Eminos New Member

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    I want scripting support! Comming in 3538! Can't Wait! .../Eminos
     
  8. Eugene Gavrilov

    Eugene Gavrilov kX Project Lead Programmer and Coordinator

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    >> add keyword such as "controlledby test.dll"

    we use guids which are more appropriate for this

    >> DSP-lookup-tables

    they are not supported
    moreover, they are hardware-dependent
    (10k2 only)

    3-D buffers use =mono= channels only [per DX7/8 specs]

    >> documentation

    no time. sorry. you can help us to write it :)

    /E
     
  9. dj_stick

    dj_stick Apple Fanboy?

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    i can't be the only one working of documentation… if anyone has anything they have written PM me
     
  10. BiCho

    BiCho Audiotecna- Representante

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    I am working on a spanish translation of the guide, where do i send it to?
     
  11. C2Mummy

    C2Mummy New Member

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    Hi,

    Here's my wishlist:

    6.1 & 7.1 support (3/3.1, 3/2+1.1 for 6.1, 3/2+2.1 for 7.1 (maybe make this user configurable).

    44.1KHz ac3/dts passthrough.

    Realtime ac3 encoding - see:

    http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?threadid=76480

    ac3filter now supports realtime ac3 encoding - this works for anything that is 48KHz with kX drivers, but kX drivers can't passthrough 44.1KHz ac3/dts yet for audigys (creative drivers can). This means CD audio / mp3's can't use ac3 encoding from ac3filter at the moment.

    Realtime high quality samplerate conversion (eg. 44.1KHz to 48KHz or 44.1/48 to 96KHz)

    dts decoding (vlc, ac3filter can do this).

    Pro-logic / Pro-logic II upconversion (again ac3filter can do this) - combine this with realtime ac3 encoding and we can have 2->5.1 ac3 upconversion (with pro-logic II).

    EAX simulation support (but no where near any of the above in terms of priority for me).

    Lots of this is aimed at home theatre users and also gamers who want multichannel games via ac3 with realtime encoding.

    Alot of the code for this stuff is floating around the net now - all it needs is porting to the DSP (sounds simple, but I guess it's not, I sure haven't a clue how to do it!)

    So, please dear Eugenious and fellow kX jedi masters, turn into Santas and give us a mid-summer-autumn-winter early xmas pressie :p

    Thanks.

    PS. the drivers rock as is, but would be *devastating* to the competition with the above! (E.L.E.!)
     
  12. dj_stick

    dj_stick Apple Fanboy?

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    C2Mummy, several of those issues are being worked on, as well as 24/96 asio, but please remember that eugene, the developer, has to make a living for himself and have a social life, so these things may take time
     
  13. isdochegal

    isdochegal New Member

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    dj_stick:
    > i think kX already has positional audio

    Maybe we disagree in what the difference of
    positional/directional audio is? See
    http://www.abnuto.de/jan/DirectSound/audio3d.html

    -----------------------
    Eugene Gavrilov:

    >3-D buffers use =mono= channels only [per DX7/8 specs]

    That's true (but somewhat sounds like you missed that
    WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE ? I think it's new with DX9).

    My point was:
    Always mapping all these channels to DSP would cost "a few" GPR,
    so (ideally) could be dynamically blended off, when unused.

    Same applies to 3D-buffers.
    Please take a look at

    http://www.abnuto.de/jan/DirectSound/DX_3d.html


    Gruss

    Jan
     
  14. Eugene Gavrilov

    Eugene Gavrilov kX Project Lead Programmer and Coordinator

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    >> isdochegal

    1. forget about waveformatextensible structure -- although it can be used, in 99% cases it is not (especially when dealing with direct sound 3d applications)
    2. 3-d audio is unrelated to speaker management at all. it is up to the driver to upmix the particular 3-d source located in 3-d space into any number of speakers
    -- under kX this is done by the kX 3d engine, which currently supports different (and configurable) speaker configurations

    yes, in theory you can configure the driver and inform it about the actual speaker localizations in your room
    (and this is one of our 'to-do')

    that is, the driver currently has a set of rules to transform any 3-d coordinates into a set of volumes for n- speakers. the present rules mainly refer to angles, but not distances (this can be easily changed). after the audio gets into the DSP, one can easily introduce additional audio processing by using several DSP effects.

    if you wish to continue our discussion, start a new thread with an appropriate title please

    /E
     
  15. dj_stick

    dj_stick Apple Fanboy?

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    using the delay plugins? for speaker management?
     
  16. isdochegal

    isdochegal New Member

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    Eugene Gavrilov:

    > 3-d audio is unrelated to speaker management at all.

    ???

    > it is up to the driver to upmix the particular 3-d source located
    > in 3-d space into any number of speakers -- under kX this is done
    > by the kX 3d engine, which currently supports different (and
    > configurable) speaker configurations

    I'll call a support hotline, if I should ever wish to hear word like
    these, thanks.

    > that is, the driver currently has a set of rules to transform any
    > 3-d coordinates into a set of volumes for n- speakers.

    Looks like n is a fixed but secret number.

    > the present rules mainly refer to angles, but not distances
    > (this can be easily changed).
    > after the audio gets into the DSP, one can easily introduce additional
    > audio processing by using several DSP effects.

    Ok, you aren't even a bit motivated to take care of 3Dbuffers,
    just like any soundcard manufactorer, as it seems.

    That's ok, but what about letting the "kx-community" find (or at least
    search for) a better solution?

    > if you wish to continue our discussion, start a new thread with an
    > appropriate title please

    Gruss auch

    Jan
     
  17. Doomsayer

    Doomsayer New Member

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    No you won't, because there's no support hotline for the kx project. This is free software after all.
    What do you mean by this? 'n' is to be taken from the driver's speaker configuration (from what I understand).
    Exactly who isn't letting you do something? If you think your idea works you are free to start implementing it in some way.
     
  18. dj_stick

    dj_stick Apple Fanboy?

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    the DSP is pretty much open source and anyone can code their own plugins to implement what you are trying to organise
     
  19. isdochegal

    isdochegal New Member

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    Doomsayer:

    > No you won't, because there's no support hotline for the kx project.
    > This is free software after all.

    Uh, I didn't know Eugene is "unfehlbar".

    > What do you mean by this? 'n' is to be taken from the driver's speaker
    > configuration (from what I understand).

    /E and me used 'n' in term of speaker count.

    The only box wehere the user can actually enter 'n' is some DSP-pligin,
    which somply doesn't have to do with things discussed here.

    > Exactly who isn't letting you do something?

    Maybe the fact that I didn't find the sources anywhere?
    Even if I had, I wouldn't directly be able to change anything
    (not fit enough with programming language, the project uses).
    Even if I were, it's up to the project coordinator to choose,
    if to use a special piece of code, or not.
    Finally, 3D-Audio isn't really a 'science' widely/completly understood.
    So don't expect it's a good idea to let one person exclusively
    do any 3D-audio related research on it's own.

    Gruss

    Jan
     
  20. Eugene Gavrilov

    Eugene Gavrilov kX Project Lead Programmer and Coordinator

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